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CluelessInSeattl(R)

Seattle, USA,
12.08.2012, 18:03
 

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages (Users)

Hi! I'm trying to resurrect an old MS-DOS 6.21 system I used to run years ago on a Toshiba 1910 CS laptop. I joined DOS ain't dead about a month ago and posted an introduction in the Miscellaneous forum: Old DOS Newbie Seeks Advice

I've made considerable progress since my last post over there, and now have my old system more or less up and running on a hand-me-down Toshiba Satellite 2545XCDT which I now use every day as my notepad.

Yesterday I tried to use the Unerase utility in Norton Utilities 5.01 to check for remnants of deleted files on the hard drive, but got this message: "Error reading directory."

The help file suggested I "calibrate" the HD, but when I tried to run the Norton Calibrate utility it returned the message: "There are no hard disks available to test."

But the Norton System Summary shows "Hard disks: 23M"

I'm more than a little rusty at just running MS-DOS for my day-to-day note-taking, so troubleshooting this discrepancy is going to present quite a challenge to me.

I'd be grateful for some help determining what first steps I can take to try to isolate the source of this problem.

---
Will in Seattle
a.k.a. "Clueless"
Running MS-DOS 6.21

ron(R)

Homepage E-mail

Australia,
13.08.2012, 00:56

@ CluelessInSeattl

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> Yesterday I tried to use the Unerase utility in Norton Utilities 5.01 to
> check for remnants of deleted files on the hard drive, but got this
> message: "Error reading directory."
>
> The help file suggested I "calibrate" the HD, but when I tried to run the
> Norton Calibrate utility it returned the message: "There are no hard disks
> available to test."
>
> But the Norton System Summary shows "Hard disks: 23M"
>
> I'd be grateful for some help determining what first steps I can take to
> try to isolate the source of this problem.

Have you tried running Norton Disk Doctor ? (ndd)

FWIW: Norton Utilities 5.01 is probably older that your laptop and may not be able to handle it.
The last, and in my opinion the best, NU for DOS is version 8. I think that is also the last version written by Peter Norton before it was sold and went downhill.

CluelessInSeattl(R)

Seattle, USA,
13.08.2012, 03:55

@ ron

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> Have you tried running Norton Disk Doctor ? (ndd)

Thanks, Ron. I just ran it and got this message:

Drive C: can't be used
NDD will not work with drives having more than 8K bytes per sector or 16K bytes per cluster


> FWIW: Norton Utilities 5.01 is probably older that your laptop and may not
> be able to handle it.
> The last, and in my opinion the best, NU for DOS is version 8. I think that
> is also the last version written by Peter Norton before it was sold and
> went downhill.

Thanks again! I found a web site that purported to have NU8 and downloaded it:

Edit by rr: removed link to abandonware site

The file I received had .RAR extension, so I downloaded a trial version of WinRAR and extracted the files. But many of the files had three letter extensions ending in exclamation points such as CALIBRAT.HL!, DISKREET.IC!

Do you have any idea what that means?

---
Will in Seattle
a.k.a. "Clueless"
Running MS-DOS 6.21

ron(R)

Homepage E-mail

Australia,
13.08.2012, 04:37

@ CluelessInSeattl

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> The file I received had .RAR extension, so I downloaded a trial version of
> WinRAR and extracted the files. But many of the files had three letter
> extensions ending in exclamation points such as CALIBRAT.HL!, DISKREET.IC!
>
> Do you have any idea what that means?

That used to be a way that disguised what each file was before it got installed.
It only worked on people who couldn't work it out for themselves.

The ! can be replaced by another letter.

e.g. .HL! = .HLP
.IC! = .ICO and so on.

Doug(R)

E-mail

13.08.2012, 08:00

@ ron

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

NU 8.0 was, indeed, the final version for FAT16 DOS/Win3. DOS 6.x support began with NU 7, so that would be the *minimum* version i'd suggest.

As NU progressed to Win9x support, they still included a few pure-DOS utilities (needed for the 'rescue' diskette facility, which of necessity, booted up in DOS). For example, the NU 2003 that i have contains FAT32-capable versions of Disk Doctor, Disk Editor, UnErase, UnFormat, and Rescue which run fine under real DOS. (They are backwards compatible with FAT16 and FAT12 as well.)

What Ron said about 'weird extensions' is often the case, but sometimes when you get stuff from 'abandonware' sites, the downloaded files contain archived versions of the actual installation diskettes. Often, you need to re-create the original diskette(s) from the downloaded archive, because the diskette files may themselves be archived/compressed (hence, the 'weird' filename extensions). Then the install/setup program on diskette must be run to properly decomprerss/install from diskette(s) to the hard drive. Somewhat messy... but those were the classic days of DOS and diskette distribution.... :-)

- Doug B.

Rugxulo(R)

Homepage

Usono,
13.08.2012, 08:26

@ CluelessInSeattl

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> Hi! I'm trying to resurrect an old MS-DOS 6.21 system I used to run years
> ago on a Toshiba 1910 CS laptop.
>
> I've made considerable progress since my last post over there, and now have
> my old system more or less up and running on a hand-me-down Toshiba
> Satellite 2545XCDT which I now use every day as my notepad.
>
> Yesterday I tried to use the Unerase utility in Norton Utilities 5.01 to
> check for remnants of deleted files on the hard drive, but got this
> message: "Error reading directory."
>
> I'm more than a little rusty at just running MS-DOS for my day-to-day
> note-taking, so troubleshooting this discrepancy is going to present quite
> a challenge to me.

This seems like a strange problem. I mean, deleted files aren't usually a reliable way to store things. ;-) So trying to get them back is difficult, if not impossible, esp. the common way things are handled (IIRC ... 0xE5 for first char in name with any space freed for later overwriting later).

If you want an undelete, try the one from FreeDOS (and DOSFSCK [386+, a la ScanDisk] if you want to fix / recover borked files and clusters).

Actually, IIRC, old 16-bit DOS Navigator 1.51 had an undelete built in (though I'm just mentioning it for completeness).

Otherwise, I don't see the urgency as all of that data is deleted anyways, hence presumably not very important. (But I could be wrong ....)

ron(R)

Homepage E-mail

Australia,
13.08.2012, 09:23

@ Rugxulo

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> Otherwise, I don't see the urgency as all of that data is deleted anyways,
> hence presumably not very important. (But I could be wrong ....)

In MS-DOS at least, when a file is deleted it is only removed from the FAT, not actually removed from the disc until it is over-written.

Arjay(R)

13.08.2012, 12:00

@ ron

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> > Otherwise, I don't see the urgency as all of that data is deleted
> anyways,
> > hence presumably not very important. (But I could be wrong ....)
>
> In MS-DOS at least, when a file is deleted it is only removed from the
> FAT, not actually removed from the disc until it is over-written.

Correct, the first character of the filename in the FAT is replaced with 0xE5 to basically say the space occupied by this file is now available for re-use. From something I was reading the other night I now understand that the choice of using 0xE5 goes back to CP/M in that CP/M disks were formatted with 0xE5 hence Marc McDonald choose to use 0xE5 as the marker for deleted files in FAT for M-DOS since in the CP/M world it is saying "this part of the disk has already been formatted" without requiring all of the sector to be re-formatted.

Providing new data has not already started to be written onto the disk then most decent data carving tools such as Foremost, Photorec, PhotoRescue should work well for recovering most data. However no tool is full proof particularly as problems of data recovery occur with the fragmentation of files.

Therefore if it is not easy to plug the drive into another machine (which incidently has risks) - what I would do is dump the entire harddisk to a file or series of files which I then rejoin/can reimage to another drive etc. In NU this can be done using the save sector option, e.g. multiple sectors can be saved over a series of floppies. This then allows the data to be easily viewed/processed with recovery tools.

This should be possible even on very old machines and also under Linux/Windows using similar tools (e.g. ports of Unix's DD).

Years ago I did just this on an 8086, saving out an old 30Mb hard drive sector by sector to floppies. Yes, extremely painful and slow but it enabled me to run various tools and importantly manually process the data as a single file allowing more data to be recovered than would possible otherwise.

CluelessInSeattl(R)

Seattle, USA,
13.08.2012, 19:30

@ Rugxulo

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> I don't see the urgency as all of that data is deleted anyways,
> hence presumably not very important. (But I could be wrong ....)

Hi again, Rugxulo!

Yes! You're right. This "unerase" problem isn't all that urgent. My health only lets me spend about an hour a day on this project of trying to get my old DOS system up and running the way it used to run a decade or more ago. So I can't afford to be in a hurry. I have to be content to just take it a day at a time. Or, actually, just an hour at a time. I keep one of those old fashioned wind-up kitchen timers next to my bed and set it for an hour each morning after breakfast. Then I work uninterrupted until the bell rings. By that time I'm pretty exhausted and so put the project aside until the next day.

The first phase of my project is to try to get all the software I used to use installed and functioning again. I think I may have mentioned in my introductory message that I used to use a lot of complicated batch files, some of which called different components of that old version of Norton Utilities. So, as a starting point, I'd like to try to find a way to get the Norton Utilities to run on my new(er) laptop.

I discovered the problem with the Norton Utilities by accident when I stumbled on an empty directory in one of my old DOS back-up diskettes, and wondered what might have once been in that directory. So, out of idle curiosity, I ran Norton Unerase and got that first error:

"Error reading directory."

And then subsequent errors when I also tried to run Calibrate:

"There are no hard disks available to test."

... then Norton Disk Doctor:

Drive C: can't be used
NDD will not work with drives having more than 8K bytes per sector or 16K bytes per cluster


So, what I'm after right now is not just a way to unerase a file, but rather a way to get Norton Utilities for DOS to run on this hand-me-down Toshiba Satellite 2545XCDT laptop.

I'm wondering if a clue to solving the problem might be found in that last error message above; the one about "bytes per sector" and "bytes per cluster". Could it be that I need to reformat the HD with different cluster sizes or something like that?

---
Will in Seattle
a.k.a. "Clueless"
Running MS-DOS 6.21

ron(R)

Homepage E-mail

Australia,
14.08.2012, 00:06

@ CluelessInSeattl

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> So, as a starting point, I'd like to try to find a way to get
> the Norton Utilities to run on my new(er) laptop.

Just put the NU directory into the path, then each may be called from anywhere.
Alternatively, use the Norton Utilities front-end.


> I'm wondering if a clue to solving the problem might be found in that last
> error message above; the one about "bytes per sector" and "bytes
> per cluster". Could it be that I need to reformat the HD with
> different cluster sizes or something like that?

If you now have Norton Utilities v8.0 that shouldn't be a problem.
I have NU 8.0 and have used it on each of my DOS machines from a '286 to a
recent high-end machine, all without problems.

I use something from NU almost every day.

---
AUSREG Consultancy http://www.ausreg.com
Tadpole Tunes http://www.tadpoletunes.com
Sna Keo Il http://www.tadpoletunes.com/sna_keo_il/

CluelessInSeattl(R)

Seattle, USA,
14.08.2012, 00:30

@ ron

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> > I'm wondering if a clue to solving the problem might be found in that
> last
> > error message above; the one about "bytes per sector" and
> "bytes
> > per cluster". Could it be that I need to reformat the HD with
> > different cluster sizes or something like that?
>
> If you now have Norton Utilities v8.0 that shouldn't be a problem.

Hi ron!

I haven't yet figured out how to get NU8 installed onto my DOS laptop. So it'll be a while before I have that up and running.

But, in the meantime, I think I've figured out what the problem is. I found a web page that shows how cluster size increases with partition size:

Partition size FAT16 Cluster size
0 - 127 MB 2 KB = 2048 B
128 - 255 MB 4 KB = 4096 B
256 - 511 MB 8 KB = 8192 B
512 - 1023 MB 16 KB = 16384 B
1024 - 2047 MB 32 KB = 32768 B


Sorry: The formatting on that table got messed up and I don't know how to fix it. You can see it here:
http://www.mdgx.com/secrets.htm#FAT32.

Well, I've got the 4 GB HD divided into two partitions of 2 GB each, so the cluster size is going to be 32 KB, right?

And what did that NU error message tell me?

"NDD will not work with drives having more than 8K bytes per sector or 16K bytes per cluster"

Bingo!

I need to reduce my partitions to one gig each, right?

I used to have a program called Partition Magic. I wonder if I can find it.

But, I probably should go back and reformat and repartition from scratch, don't you think?

---
Will in Seattle
a.k.a. "Clueless"
Running MS-DOS 6.21

Rugxulo(R)

Homepage

Usono,
14.08.2012, 00:43

@ CluelessInSeattl

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

N.B. I'm far from a FAT or partition or installation expert, and it's something I haven't done a lot, esp. not lately. So take it with a tiny grain of salt (even though it's not hard to do, just hard to do perfectly).

> But, in the meantime, I think I've figured out what the problem is. I
> found a web page that shows how cluster size increases with partition
> size:
>
> Well, I've got the 4 GB HD divided into two partitions of 2 GB each, so the
> cluster size is going to be 32 KB, right?
>
> And what did that NU error message tell me?
>
> "NDD will not work with drives having more than 8K bytes per sector
> or 16K bytes per cluster"
>
> Bingo!
>
> I need to reduce my partitions to one gig each, right?

Not necessarily. You only need one active FAT partition. The rest can be extended FAT partitions. So, in theory, you could have eight partitions of 512 MB each (which is probably the cutoff for 8 kb clusters for FAT16).

1 GB really wastes a lot of space in slack, though not as bad as 2 GB (32 kb? *shudder*). It doesn't matter if you don't need it, but it's horribly inefficient. I was always kicking myself when I found that out (but couldn't easily reformat).

Actually, FAT32 seems to be better about that, e.g. my 4 GB partition has 4 kb clusters (I think), so that's way better. Of course, you need a compatible DOS, e.g. FreeDOS, but that won't work with your Norton Utilities, sadly. Still, just FYI.

> I used to have a program called Partition Magic. I wonder if I can find
> it.

Presumably you can just use any old FDISK (assuming you're only running DOS, nothing else).

> But, I probably should go back and reformat and repartition from scratch,
> don't you think?

Maybe, if you can afford to waste time and data. Otherwise, you may? be able to resize the partitions with PRESZ134.ZIP.

Doug(R)

E-mail

14.08.2012, 18:51

@ CluelessInSeattl

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

Will in Seattle -

> Well, I've got the 4 GB HD divided into two partitions of 2 GB each, so the
> cluster size is going to be 32 KB, right?

Yes, unless you have an unusually-formatted drive (which is very unlikely).

> And what did that NU error message tell me?
>
> "NDD will not work with drives having more than 8K bytes per sector
> or 16K bytes per cluster"
>
> Bingo!
>
> I need to reduce my partitions to one gig each, right?

Not necessarily! I'm assuming from previous posts that you're using NU 5. It's possible that the problem is there -- that that version might not be able to read that cluster/partition size. I used NU 8 for a long time on FAT16 drives, and it never had a problem with 2gb (max) partitions.

> I used to have a program called Partition Magic. I wonder if I can find
> it.
>
> But, I probably should go back and reformat and repartition from scratch,
> don't you think?

Re-partitioning is a messy process (i've done it with FDisk and Partition Magic). And IIRC, repartitioning with FDisk will destroy *all* the data on the drive, and with PM will destroy the erased data that you're trying to recover!

My suggestion is to try to get NU 8 up and running on your computer and use that. (IIRC, NU 5 did not even support DOS 5, much less DOS 6!) I think you'll be far happier with the most-advanced NU version that was dedicated to classic DOS. And have far less headaches than trying to re-partition your drive just to use a much-older utility set.

> I haven't yet figured out how to get NU8 installed onto my DOS laptop. So
> it'll be a while before I have that up and running.

I'm sure we'd all be willing to help to try and get that NU 8 download working on your system!

- Doug B.

CluelessInSeattl(R)

Seattle, USA,
14.08.2012, 22:31

@ Doug

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> I'm sure we'd all be willing to help to try and get that NU 8 download
> working on your system!

OK, Doug, You're on!

That would probably be preferable to trying to repartition the drive.

So, this morning I copied all the NU 8 files from my Windows PC onto a set of four floppies.

Now, I guess I should copy all the those files onto my DOS laptop into a directory named something like INSTALL.NU8.

Was NU8 originally distributed on floppies? If so, are we going to have to try to recreate the contents of the orginal distribution floppies? Or can we manage with all the files in a single directory, which is the way I got them from the web?

As I'm typing this I just realized that I forgot to copy the sub-directory UPDATE onto a floppy, so I'll do that tomorrow.

That UPDATE sub-directory contains these files:

06/25/1994 04:08 PM 390 FILE_ID.DIZ
06/14/1994 07:30 PM 1,962,583 NU8.EXE
08/12/1992 06:00 AM 76,981 PATCH.EXE
06/02/1994 07:37 PM 1,529 README.UPD
06/02/1994 07:37 PM 223 RUNME.BAT
06/14/1994 11:29 AM 2,023 UPDATE.BAT

That's as far as I've managed to get today.

---
Will in Seattle
a.k.a. "Clueless"
Running MS-DOS 6.21

ron(R)

Homepage E-mail

Australia,
15.08.2012, 00:11

@ CluelessInSeattl

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> Now, I guess I should copy all the those files onto my DOS laptop into a
> directory named something like INSTALL.NU8.

I put mine into c:\norton

> Was NU8 originally distributed on floppies?

Yes.

> If so, are we going to have to
> try to recreate the contents of the orginal distribution floppies?

No.

> Or can we manage with all the files in a single directory, which is the way
> I got them from the web?

Yes.

> As I'm typing this I just realized that I forgot to copy the sub-directory
> UPDATE onto a floppy, so I'll do that tomorrow.
>
> That UPDATE sub-directory contains these files:
>
> 06/25/1994 04:08 PM 390 FILE_ID.DIZ
> 06/14/1994 07:30 PM 1,962,583 NU8.EXE
> 08/12/1992 06:00 AM 76,981 PATCH.EXE
> 06/02/1994 07:37 PM 1,529 README.UPD
> 06/02/1994 07:37 PM 223 RUNME.BAT
> 06/14/1994 11:29 AM 2,023 UPDATE.BAT

Put all the files into one directory, then use the UPDATE files to over-write the older versions.

FWIW: This is what I have in my NU8 directory:


Volume in drive C is MS-DOS_5
Volume Serial Number is 3232-8513
Directory of C:\NORTON

INIADVSR HLP 575,406 23/04/94 8:00
NDIAGS EXE 291,113 23/04/94 8:00
SMARTCAN INI 37 29/03/99 15:31
NDDWBMPS DLL 611,392 23/04/94 8:00
NDDW EXE 280,224 23/04/94 8:00
READ ME 65,998 23/04/94 8:00
CHKLIST MS 1,593 06/10/94 14:18
DISKREET SYS 53,248 23/04/94 8:00
INSTALL EXE 16,992 23/04/94 8:00
WHATS NEW 1,399 23/04/94 8:00
NDD EXE 223,852 23/04/94 8:00
NDOS DOC 816,886 23/04/94 8:00
NUCONFIG EXE 209,145 23/04/94 8:00
NLIB200 RTL 200,650 23/04/94 8:00
DISKEDIT EXE 131,223 23/04/94 8:00
FILEFIX EXE 114,776 23/04/94 8:00
UNERASE EXE 113,947 23/04/94 8:00
DISKTOOL EXE 55,578 23/04/94 8:00
NDIAGS HLP 104,978 23/04/94 8:00
NDD MSG 31,866 23/04/94 8:00
UNFORMAT EXE 29,161 23/04/94 8:00
SAMPLES BTM 4,527 23/04/94 8:00
INITRAKD EXE 380,222 23/04/94 8:00
SPEEDISK EXE 354,082 23/04/94 8:00
WIPEINFO EXE 152,102 23/04/94 8:00
NDOSHELP HLP 329,161 23/04/94 8:00
SYMGUI3 DLL 275,056 23/04/94 8:00
SYSINFO EXE 96,432 23/04/94 8:00
RESCUE EXE 76,887 23/04/94 8:00
NDOS COM 113,042 23/04/94 8:00
NSCGLOSS HLP 112,206 23/04/94 8:00
SDENGINB DLL 125,120 23/04/94 8:00
SYMKRNL3 DLL 132,704 23/04/94 8:00
FILEFIND EXE 59,625 23/04/94 8:00
NCD EXE 59,404 23/04/94 8:00
SYSWATCH HLP 97,250 23/04/94 8:00
SYMDB3 DLL 121,296 23/04/94 8:00
INITRACK HLP 87,450 23/04/94 8:00
INITUNER HLP 84,221 23/04/94 8:00
SDW HLP 82,476 23/04/94 8:00
DISKREET EXE 52,086 23/04/94 8:00
CALIBRAT EXE 51,365 23/04/94 8:00
NDDW HLP 74,850 23/04/94 8:00
FCOMPARE HLP 75,309 23/04/94 8:00
INIEDITR HLP 68,256 23/04/94 8:00
SYMUTIL3 DLL 88,128 23/04/94 8:00
SDW EXE 94,368 23/04/94 8:00
SMARTCAN EXE 38,660 23/04/94 8:00
SFORMAT EXE 38,251 23/04/94 8:00
NCACHE2 EXE 80,468 23/04/94 8:00
INITRACK EXE 72,480 23/04/94 8:00
SYSWATCH EXE 86,336 23/04/94 8:00
NCC EXE 32,565 23/04/94 8:00
NORTON EXE 32,478 23/04/94 8:00
FCOMPARE EXE 68,560 23/04/94 8:00
DISKEDIT HLP 85,633 23/04/94 8:00
DS EXE 28,510 23/04/94 8:00
INITUNER EXE 63,760 23/04/94 8:00
SYMFAT3 DLL 59,296 23/04/94 8:00
SYSMON DLL 46,832 23/04/94 8:00
NDIAGS SND 55,721 23/04/94 8:00
ADVISE HLP 81,131 23/04/94 8:00
NORTON HLP 62,313 23/04/94 8:00
SYSINFO HLP 61,907 23/04/94 8:00
NORTON CPL 44,912 23/04/94 8:00
LP EXE 20,356 23/04/94 8:00
TS EXE 20,105 23/04/94 8:00
BE EXE 19,049 23/04/94 8:00
INIEDITR EXE 39,024 23/04/94 8:00
DISKMON EXE 17,073 23/04/94 8:00
APPNOTES DOC 48,485 23/04/94 8:00
NPT3 DLL 34,656 23/04/94 8:00
DUPDISK EXE 14,137 23/04/94 8:00
IMAGE EXE 13,769 23/04/94 8:00
FD EXE 13,385 23/04/94 8:00
FS EXE 13,273 23/04/94 8:00
NUCONFIG HLP 35,252 23/04/94 8:00
FL EXE 12,601 23/04/94 8:00
DRVMAP3 DLL 24,272 23/04/94 8:00
FILEFIND HLP 34,537 23/04/94 8:00
FA EXE 11,049 23/04/94 8:00
UNERASE HLP 31,351 23/04/94 8:00
INITRAKD HLP 27,202 23/04/94 8:00
NDD HLP 26,390 23/04/94 8:00
SMARTCAN HLP 26,707 23/04/94 8:00
NCD HLP 22,976 23/04/94 8:00
SPEEDISK HLP 24,638 23/04/94 8:00
NCC HLP 21,143 23/04/94 8:00
NDOSHELP EXE 7,537 23/04/94 8:00
DISKREET HLP 20,940 23/04/94 8:00
FILEFIX HLP 17,475 23/04/94 8:00
CALIBRAT HLP 14,891 23/04/94 8:00
INSTDOS EXE 12,112 23/04/94 8:00
SFORMAT HLP 12,528 23/04/94 8:00
WIPEINFO HLP 11,865 23/04/94 8:00
RESCUE HLP 12,114 23/04/94 8:00
UNFORMAT HLP 11,314 23/04/94 8:00
SYMMAIL3 DLL 9,632 23/04/94 8:00
DISKTOOL HLP 10,131 23/04/94 8:00
NCACHE DOC 9,383 23/04/94 8:00
DISKMON HLP 8,613 23/04/94 8:00
ALIASES 9,557 23/04/94 8:00

---
AUSREG Consultancy http://www.ausreg.com
Tadpole Tunes http://www.tadpoletunes.com
Sna Keo Il http://www.tadpoletunes.com/sna_keo_il/

CluelessInSeattl(R)

Seattle, USA,
15.08.2012, 04:13

@ ron

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> Put all the files into one directory, then use the UPDATE files to
> over-write the older versions.

Thanks ron!

I've run into a minor glitch.

The NU8.EXE file in the UPDATE directory is 1,917 KB.

I tried using PKZIP to compress it, but it was still too large to fit onto a floppy.

So I tried to remember how to get PKZIP to span the Zip file across two floppies with this command:

pkzip -& a:\nu8.zip nu8.exe

But, when I enter that command, PKZIP just displays an instruction page.

I'm more than a little rusty on my DOS commands.

Can you help me figure out how to get NU8.EXE onto a floppy (or floppies) so I can copy it onto the HD on my DOS laptop?

---
Will in Seattle
a.k.a. "Clueless"
Running MS-DOS 6.21

ron(R)

Homepage E-mail

Australia,
15.08.2012, 07:24
(edited by ron, 15.08.2012, 07:49)

@ CluelessInSeattl

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> I've run into a minor glitch.
>
> The NU8.EXE file in the UPDATE directory is 1,917 KB.

I have no file called NU8.EXE ! And no single file anywhere near that size.

I think it's a fair bet that NU8.EXE is a self-extracting archive file containing all the other files.

But if you really need to copy it, there are DOS utilities that will split large files to fit on floppies, and can re-assemble the bits after transfer.

e.g. HJSPLIT
http://www.freebyte.com/download/hjsplit/hjspldos.zip

---
AUSREG Consultancy http://www.ausreg.com
Tadpole Tunes http://www.tadpoletunes.com
Sna Keo Il http://www.tadpoletunes.com/sna_keo_il/

CluelessInSeattl(R)

Seattle, USA,
15.08.2012, 14:41

@ ron

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> I have no file called NU8.EXE ! And no single file anywhere near that
> size.
>
> I think it's a fair bet that NU8.EXE is a self-extracting archive file
> containing all the other files.

Aha! You hit the nail on the head!

I just double-clicked that NU8.EXE file in Windows Explorer and, sure enough, it opened a command prompt window and ran PKUNZIP and tried to start extracting all the component files all over again.

So, we're back on track! Thanks for that tip!

Now, I'm going back to your earlier message to make sure I understand your instructions.

---
Will in Seattle
a.k.a. "Clueless"
Running MS-DOS 6.21

CluelessInSeattl(R)

Seattle, USA,
15.08.2012, 15:23

@ ron

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> Put all the files into one directory,

A new directory? Or my old NORTON directory that contains the NU5 files?

Should I copy the files from the UPDATE directory into the NORTON directory, or leave them in the UPDATE directory?


> then use the UPDATE files to
> over-write the older versions.

I looked at the UPDATE instructions, and the RUNME.BAT file expects to find the NU8.EXE file. So, should I just try running the UPDATE.BAT file instead?

Would you like me to post the text of the BAT files in the UPDATE directory?

---
Will in Seattle
a.k.a. "Clueless"
Running MS-DOS 6.21

ron(R)

Homepage E-mail

Australia,
15.08.2012, 23:45

@ CluelessInSeattl

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> > Put all the files into one directory,
>
> A new directory? Or my old NORTON directory that contains the NU5 files?

I would keep the NU8 files separate from the NU5 files.

> Should I copy the files from the UPDATE directory into the NORTON
> directory, or leave them in the UPDATE directory?
>
> I looked at the UPDATE instructions, and the RUNME.BAT file expects to find
> the NU8.EXE file. So, should I just try running the UPDATE.BAT file
> instead?

I can't see what you can see, so I would be guessing.

> Would you like me to post the text of the BAT files in the UPDATE
> directory?

Couldn't hurt. :)

CluelessInSeattl(R)

Seattle, USA,
16.08.2012, 03:14

@ ron

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

OK, first of all, here's the text of the README.UPD file. From reading this file I get the impression that what I've downloaded may be an updater for an already installed version of NU8. Does it look that way to you?

================= README.UPD =======================================

Norton Utilities Update

This update for Norton Utilities version 8.0 provides support for
Windows for Workgroups 3.11 32-bit file access and support for DOS 6.22.

INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS
-------------------------
To update the current version of Norton Utilties 8.0 follow these
simple steps.


1) If you are currently running Windows (any version), exit from it.
2) Copy the NU8.EXE and the RUNME.BAT file to the drive containing
Norton Utilities.
3) Run the batch file called RUNME.BAT



This batch file will do the following:

1) Delete all old copies of SYMEVNT1.DLL except for the one in your
WINDOWS\SYSTEM sub-directory.

2) Copy updated versions SYMEVNT1.DLL and SYMEVNT.386 to your
WINDOWS\SYSTEM subdirectory if the existing ones are an earlier
version.

3) Copy the files about to be patched to a subdirectory called
"BACKUP" off the Norton Utilities subdirectory.

4) Copy the patch program and patch file to the subdirectory
containing Norton Utilities version 8.0. This will require that
you have the NU environment variable set. (type "SET NU" to see if
it is. Set it with a command such as "SET NU=C:\NU".)

5) Several of the NU 8.0 files will be updated.

6) The patch program and patch file will be deleted from the NU
subdirectory.

After the patch has been completed and you are satisfied the
process was successful, you may delete the backup directory that
was created in step 3.

---
Will in Seattle
a.k.a. "Clueless"
Running MS-DOS 6.21

CluelessInSeattl(R)

Seattle, USA,
16.08.2012, 03:19

@ CluelessInSeattl

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

Here's the text of the RUNME.BAT and UPDATE.BAT files:

===================== START RUNME.BAT ==================================

@echo off
md \nu8upd
copy nu8.exe \nu8upd\nu8.exe
cd \nu8upd
nu8.exe
call update
echo Please read the README.UPD file in %NU% for more information about
echo this patch.

echo Y | del \nu8upd\*.* >nul
rd \nu8upd

==================== END RUNME.BAT ====================================

=================== START UPDATE.BAT ==================================

@echo off

if not x%windir%x==xx GOTO NODOSBOX
if x%NU%x==xx GOTO NONUENV

md %NU%\backup
echo Backing up files into %NU%\backup

copy %NU%\DRVMAP3.DLL %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\NPT3.DLL %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\SDENGINB.DLL %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\SYMDB3.DLL %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\SYMFAT3.DLL %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\SYMGUI3.DLL %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\SYMKRNL3.DLL %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\SYMMAIL3.DLL %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\SYSMON.DLL %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\TRAKISR.DLL %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\NDDW.EXE %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\SDW.EXE %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\NDIAGS.EXE %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\NDDW.HLP %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\SDW.HLP %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\NDD.EXE %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\NDD.MSG %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\SPEEDISK.EXE %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\SYSINFO.EXE %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\SFORMAT.EXE %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\RESCUE.EXE %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\DISKTOOL.EXE %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\NCACHE2.EXE %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\WIPEINFO.EXE %NU%\backup >nul
copy %NU%\NDOS.COM %NU%\backup >nul

copy \nu8upd\readme.upd %NU% >nul


symup
copy nu8patch.rtp %NU%
copy patch.exe %NU%
cd %NU%

patch nu8patch


rem Remove the files that were extracted and the patch file itself
DEL nu8patch.RTP > NUL
DEL patch.EXE > NUL


echo Before being patching, the appropriate files have been backed up
echo into %NU%\backup. You may delete those files and that directory
echo later at your convenience.


GOTO END


:NONUENV

echo Please make sure your NU environment variable is set to the
echo directory containing your Norton Utilities 8.0 programs.
echo Do this by typing
echo SET NU=drive:\path
echo (Where "drive:\path" is the location of your NU8 files)
goto END


:NODOSBOX
echo Please exit WINDOWS completely and rerun this program
goto END



:END

======================= END UPDATE.BAT ==============================

---
Will in Seattle
a.k.a. "Clueless"
Running MS-DOS 6.21

Doug(R)

E-mail

16.08.2012, 21:44

@ CluelessInSeattl

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

In NU8, the .DLL files as well as all the .EXE files that end in W (for example, NDDW.EXE) are Windows programs -- NU8 included a bunch of utilities for Windows 3.1 too... but they're not needed for (and won't run on) a DOS-only system.

So in the "UPDATES.BAT" file, the first 15 files copied to the BACKUP\ subdirectory are Windows files, and the last 10 are DOS files -- the README file says that these are the names of the files that get patched. But the README said it updates the DOS utilities to run with DOS 6.22, so if you're only using DOS 6.21, you don't need these updated either. (Of course, it wouldn't hurt anything either.)

But at this point, i'm also kind of unsure of exactly what it was you downloaded. Is the "Updates" directory just a *part* of the download or is it the *entire* download?

What might help is if you could post a listing of all the files in the downloaded archive. That way, we'd all be on the same page, and we'd have a more-definite idea of how to proceed. Also, what files were extracted from NU8.EXE? If it's a zip-archive executable, try running:

  pkunzip /vb nu8.exe > nu8.lst

and have a look at the NU8.LST that was created.

Also i want to mention again: The DOS6 utility UNDELETE is similar to the NU UNERASE, and the DOS6 utility SCANDISK is similar to the NU DiskDoctor. You should have both these DOS utilities in your MS-DOS 6.21 distribution. I mention this just in case you want to get going looking for deleted files on the drive. Norton Utilities are nice, but you should already have the tools to get started!

- Doug B.

Doug(R)

E-mail

16.08.2012, 21:56

@ ron

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> > But many of the files had three letter extensions ending in
> > exclamation points such as CALIBRAT.HL!, DISKREET.IC!
> >
> > Do you have any idea what that means?
>
> That used to be a way that disguised what each file was before it got
> installed.
> It only worked on people who couldn't work it out for themselves.
>
> The ! can be replaced by another letter.
>
> e.g. .HL! = .HLP
> .IC! = .ICO and so on.

Ron, i believe that in NU8, the installation-disk files that end in ! are zip archives. If you look at them with a hex viewer, they begin with the letters "PK"... and they can be successfully unzipped with an unzipper.

But you're right that they tried to hide the true nature of these files by changing the extension from the almost-universally-used ".ZIP". I guess they wanted to 'urge' users to use the installer they provided... which, ironically, only ran under Windows!

- Doug B.

Doug(R)

E-mail

16.08.2012, 22:00

@ ron

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> FWIW: This is what I have in my NU8 directory:
>
> <snip>

Ron - Interestingly, the file dates in your list are the "later" NU8 version (Apr-23 as opposed to Feb-28). There are some file-size differences between the two releases as well. I wonder if they 'silently' updated NU 8.0 without renumbering?

And i'm wondering how that relates to Will's "Updates", as it seems to patch some DOS files....

- Doug B.

CluelessInSeattl(R)

Seattle, USA,
18.08.2012, 00:11

@ Doug

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> But at this point, i'm also kind of unsure of exactly what it was you
> downloaded. Is the "Updates" directory just a *part* of the download or is
> it the *entire* download?

Hi Doug!

The UPDATE directory is a sub-directory of the entire download.

Here's where I downloaded what I thought was Norton Utilities, version 8:

Edit by rr: removed download link

> What might help is if you could post a listing of all the files in the
> downloaded archive. That way, we'd all be on the same page, and we'd have
> a more-definite idea of how to proceed.

OK, here's a list, but I have to apologize in advance for the formatting. I don't know how to keep the columns lined up:

ADVISE HL! 22,379 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
ALIASES __! 3,644 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
APPNOTES DO! 16,793 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
BE EXE 19,049 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
CALIBRAT EXE 51,364 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
CALIBRAT HL! 6,365 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
CONFIG SYS 41 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
CONFIG1 NP! 202 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
CONFIG2 NP! 192 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
CONFIG3 NP! 231 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
CPAGE437 PS! 900 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
CPAGE850 PS! 1,025 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
CPAGE852 PS! 814 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
CPAGE860 PS! 900 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
CPAGE863 PS! 888 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
CPAGE865 PS! 899 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
CPAGE866 PS! 652 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DESCRIPT TX! 1,548 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DISKEDIT EXE 131,224 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DISKEDIT HL! 29,184 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DISKMON EXE 17,072 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DISKMON HL! 3,856 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DISKREET EXE 52,086 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DISKREET HL! 7,223 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DISKREET IC! 461 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DISKREET SY! 18,742 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DISKTOOL EXE 55,578 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DISKTOOL HL! 4,519 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DRVMAP3 DL! 11,549 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DS EXE 28,509 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DS HL! 3,185 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DUPDISK EXE 14,136 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DUPDISK HL! 2,231 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
DUPDISK IC! 436 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
EMERGNCY CMD 1,392 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
FA EXE 11,049 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
FCOMPARE EX! 30,573 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
FCOMPARE HL! 48,259 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
FD EXE 13,385 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
FILEFIND EXE 59,626 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
FILEFIND HL! 11,415 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
FILEFIND IC! 454 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
FILEFIX EXE 114,775 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
FILEFIX HL! 6,488 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
FILEFIX IC! 476 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
FL EXE 12,601 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
FS EXE 13,273 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
IMAGE EXE 13,769 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
INIADVSR HL! 412,968 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
INIADVSR IC! 417 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
INIEDITR EX! 17,961 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
INIEDITR HL! 42,548 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
INITRACK EX! 33,120 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
INITRACK HL! 54,871 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
INITRAKD EX! 195,960 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
INITRAKD HL! 10,583 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
INITUNER EX! 26,344 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
INITUNER HL! 52,519 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
INSTALL CFG 24,057 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
INSTALL EXE 16,992 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
INSTALLD EXE 271,234 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
INSTDOS EX! 6,015 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
KSTACK CO! 635 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
LP EXE 20,356 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NCACHE DO! 3,905 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NCACHE EX! 36,464 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NCC EXE 32,565 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NCC HL! 8,433 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NCD EXE 59,404 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NCD HL! 8,740 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NCD IC! 371 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDD EXE 222,991 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDD HL! 10,089 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDD MSG 31,067 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDDW EX! 122,941 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDDW HL! 49,117 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDDWBMPS DL! 225,119 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDIAGS CF! 510 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDIAGS EXE 291,120 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDIAGS HL! 33,542 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDIAGS SG! 509 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDIAGS SN! 22,964 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDIAGS UK! 464 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDOS CO! 71,927 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDOS DO! 212,915 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDOS IC! 300 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDOSHELP EXE 7,536 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NDOSHELP HL! 109,853 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NLIB200 RTL 200,650 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NORTCMD TX! 4,891 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NORTON CP! 20,625 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NORTON EXE 32,475 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NORTON HL! 21,668 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NORTON IC! 439 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NPT3 DL! 16,671 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NSCGLOSS HL! 71,161 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
nu8unzip lst 0 08/17/2012 02:44 PM
NUCONFIG EXE 116,078 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NUCONFIG HL! 13,174 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
NUSETUP CF! 1,622 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
READ ME 65,664 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
RESCUE EXE 76,885 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
RESCUE HL! 4,925 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
RESCUE IC! 434 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
RESCUE IN! 1,367 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SAMPLES BT! 1,978 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SDENGINB DL! 68,674 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SDW EX! 38,787 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SDW HL! 52,454 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SFORMAT EXE 38,251 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SFORMAT HL! 5,106 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SFORMAT IC! 434 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SMARTCAN EXE 38,659 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SMARTCAN HL! 9,747 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SPEEDISK EX! 191,225 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SPEEDISK HL! 8,719 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
STARTUP EXE 22,192 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SYMCFG BIN 643 09/14/1994 02:49 PM
SYMDB3 DL! 41,446 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SYMEVNT 386 29,286 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SYMEVNT1 DLL 3,680 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SYMFAT3 DL! 25,220 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SYMGUI3 DL! 105,149 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SYMKRNL3 DL! 60,041 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SYMMAIL3 DL! 4,634 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SYMUTIL3 DL! 40,393 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SYSINFO EXE 96,431 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SYSINFO HL! 20,759 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SYSINFO IC! 372 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SYSMON DL! 24,308 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SYSWATCH EX! 33,033 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
SYSWATCH HL! 59,461 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
TOUR1 BT! 214 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
TOUR2 BT! 768 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
TRAKISR DL! 1,212 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
TS EXE 20,105 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
UNERASE EXE 113,946 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
UNERASE HL! 10,835 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
UNFORMAT EXE 29,160 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
UNFORMAT HL! 4,757 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
UPDATE <DIR> 08/17/2012 02:21 PM
WHATS NEW 1,399 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
WIPEINFO EXE 152,139 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
WIPEINFO HL! 5,025 03/01/1994 07:00 AM
143 File(s) 5,604,209 bytes
3 Dir(s) 1,061,904,384 bytes free

[Continued in next message]

---
Will in Seattle
a.k.a. "Clueless"
Running MS-DOS 6.21

CluelessInSeattl(R)

Seattle, USA,
18.08.2012, 00:16

@ CluelessInSeattl

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

[Continued from previous message]

Here's the contents of the UPDATE directory:

FILE_ID DIZ 390 06/25/1994 04:08 PM
NU8 EXE 1,962,583 06/14/1994 07:30 PM
PATCH EXE 76,981 08/12/1992 06:00 AM
PKUNZIP EXE 29,378 02/01/1993 02:04 AM
PKZIP EXE 42,166 02/01/1993 02:04 AM
README UPD 1,529 06/02/1994 07:37 PM
RUNME BAT 223 06/02/1994 07:37 PM
UPDATE BAT 2,023 06/14/1994 11:29 AM
update lst 0 08/17/2012 02:52 PM
9 File(s) 2,115,273 bytes
2 Dir(s) 1,062,121,472 bytes free


> Also, what files were extracted
> from NU8.EXE? If it's a zip-archive executable, try running:
> [code]
> pkunzip /vb nu8.exe > nu8.lst

Searching ZIP: NU8.EXE

Length Method Size Ratio Date Time Name
------ ------ ----- ----- ---- ---- ----
2023 DeflatN 694 66% 06-14-94 11:29 UPDATE.BAT
76981 DeflatN 45141 42% 08-12-92 06:00 PATCH.EXE
1529 DeflatN 714 54% 06-02-94 12:37 README.UPD
1767469 DeflatN 1730905 3% 06-14-94 12:29 NU8PATCH.RTP
113838 DeflatN 111441 3% 05-05-94 11:15 SYMUP.EXE
3824 DeflatN 2089 46% 05-18-94 08:00 SYMEVNT1.DLL
33430 DeflatN 14995 56% 05-18-94 08:00 SYMEVNT.386
88128 DeflatN 40241 55% 05-18-94 08:00 SYMUTIL3.DLL
------ ------ --- -------
2087222 1946220 7% 8

> Also i want to mention again: The DOS6 utility UNDELETE is similar to the
> NU UNERASE, and the DOS6 utility SCANDISK is similar to the NU DiskDoctor.
> You should have both these DOS utilities in your MS-DOS 6.21 distribution.
> I mention this just in case you want to get going looking for deleted files
> on the drive. Norton Utilities are nice, but you should already have the
> tools to get started!

Thanks for that tip, Doug.

At this point my objective is just to get my old DOS system up and running on my new(er) laptop in the same way that it ran on the old and long since dead laptop. As I think I may have mentioned, I had a lot of complex batch files on that system that called Norton utilities.

So, right now, all I'm after is trying to revive the old system.

Then, once I get it working right, I would like to begin the process of transferring it over to a current version of DOS. But I'm not ready to start making modifications in it at this point. If I were to try to substitute an MS-DOS utility for a Norton utility it would mean making a lot of changes in a bunch of batch files. And that would be opening a whole new can of worms.

My health is failing and I have precious little energy left to me, so I can only take this project slowly and in very small steps.

At this point I'm thinking that the most logical next step would be to reformat the hard drive in the new(er) laptop into smaller partitions that my old Norton 5 would be able to see. I still have the hard drive from my old laptop, so I could look at it to determine the size of its partitions, and then create the same size partitions on this newer machine.

I'd still like to get that Norton 8 running though, so I'd have it handy if I decide to switch over to larger partitions. But who knows. Maybe I'll be just fine with smaller partitions. After all, I'm just creating text files, that don't take up much space.

---
Will in Seattle
a.k.a. "Clueless"
Running MS-DOS 6.21

rr(R)

Homepage E-mail

Berlin, Germany,
18.08.2012, 20:42

@ CluelessInSeattl

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> Here's where I downloaded what I thought was Norton Utilities, version 8:
>
> Edit by rr: removed download link

Will, would you be so kind to stop posting links to still copyrighted software?! :-| Thanks!

Doug(R)

E-mail

18.08.2012, 23:54

@ CluelessInSeattl

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

Ok, that list helps a lot. I just pulled out my old NU8 installation diskettes, and comparing them to the posted list, they look similar. (Except for the "Update" directory and SYMCFG.BIN file which are not on my diskettes.)

So i did a test install with my files under the plainest-vanilla DOS i could, just to check everything out again... in lieu of my failing memory. All i had to do was run the INSTALL.EXE program and answer some prompts -- it took me through the entire process, step by step. I chose "Custom Install" (rather than "Full Install") so i didn't have to install any of the Windows utilities or icons.

So when i said in a previous post that it only installed under Windows, i was mistaken (there goes that darn ol' memory again!) I seem to have been confusing INSTALL.EXE (from the installation diskette) with INSTDOS.EXE (which is *created* by the installation) -- it was INSTDOS.EXE that requires Windows! I was remembering the wrong filename....

Anyway, after installation is complete, running NUCONFIG.EXE configures the whole set of utilities, running NORTON.EXE invokes the shell, and of course, each utility can run individually from the command line if one prefers.

Finally, something the opening installation screen cautions about that i think bears repeating: Don't install/copy the utilities onto a harddrive if there are any files on it that you want to unerase! Instead, copy the UNERASE.EXE, UNERASE.HLP, and NLIB200.RTL files to a diskette and use them from there. When you're done unerasing, *then* copy all the NU files to the harddisk.

- Doug B.

CluelessInSeattl(R)

Seattle, USA,
19.08.2012, 01:53

@ rr

Norton Utilities 5.01 Error Messages

> > Edit by rr: removed download link
>
> Will, would you be so kind to stop posting links to still copyrighted
> software?! :-| Thanks!

Sure!

Thanks for the heads up!

---
Will in Seattle
a.k.a. "Clueless"
Running MS-DOS 6.21

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