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Rugxulo(R)

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Usono,
25.01.2016, 21:03
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7 (Announce)

On 25 Jan 2016, the developers of Hammer of Thyrion (HeXen II) released version 1.5.7.

Noticeable changes:
===================
* All platforms, gameplay, mission pack: fixed an hcode bug which would make the spiders seemingly invincible for a difficulty-depending time.
* All platforms, gameplay: Crusader partial heal at certain experience thresholds now starts at level 3 to be consistent with the manual.
* All platforms, gameplay: Many small HexenC fixes and clean-ups.
* All platforms, hexen2: Better cross-map demo playback support.
* OpenGL: fix screenshots when screen width isn't a multiple of 4.
* OpenGL: minor gamma updates.
* Music: Support for FLAC codec and tracker (MOD) music including unreal umx files. (edit the makefiles to enable when compiling.)
* Utils, hcc: Added a command line option "-os" to compact the strings heap by eliminating duplicates. some minor revisions.
* Utils, jsh2color: ignore minlight values from the -light command line switch: eliminates the majority of the ugly black patches from eidolon and rider2c maps. bumped its version to 1.2.6.
* All platforms: External wal texture loading is now a compile time option, disabled by default.
* HexenWorld: Support for a new protocol 26: if the client sends '*cap' userinfo with a 'c', the server returns protocol 26 instead of 25 and sends the sound and model lists in small chunks like quakeworld does. Old clients versus new servers and new clients versus old servers are not affected and run using the original protocol 25 as they used to. The new protocol 26 connection sequence avoids packet fragmentation.
* DOS: HexenWorld is now supported on DOS. requires uhexen2 v1.5.7 or newer hexenworld servers to connect. (see above for hw protocol 26.)
* DOS: OpenGL support on 3Dfx Voodoo cards.
* DOS: Experimental support for several PCI sound cards (see README.dos)
* Several small fixes, tidy-ups, safeguards elsewhere in the sources.
* Updated third-party libraries (music codecs and SDL).

Website: http://uhexen2.sourceforge.net/
Download: http://sourceforge.net/project/downloading.php?group_id=124987&filename=hexen2-1.5.7-dos.zip (13 MB)

RayeR(R)

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CZ,
26.01.2016, 19:11

@ Rugxulo
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

Hehe, I already tried with -sndpci and plays nice on my SB Audigy 2, like Quake 2 for DOS :) But even on my i7 I have some performance issues in hexen, when I come slose to water or teleport (translucent objects) it significantly slow down to say 5 FPS. And when I go to menu during current game it's very very laggy (If I go to menu on startup before selecting game it's OK). I also have problems with mouse wheel and mid. button binging on my Intelli mouse explorer.

---
DOS gives me freedom to unlimited HW access.

Rugxulo(R)

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Usono,
27.01.2016, 01:39

@ RayeR
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

> Hehe, I already tried with -sndpci and plays nice on my SB Audigy 2, like
> Quake 2 for DOS :)

-sndpci works on this PC, too (Intel HDA).

> But even on my i7 I have some performance issues in
> hexen, when I come slose to water or teleport (translucent objects) it
> significantly slow down to say 5 FPS.

I never notice any significant slowdown, but I'm not that picky. I do know that higher resolutions tend to be slower than lower. So if you want fastest speed, perhaps it's best to stick to low res (320x200).

> And when I go to menu during current
> game it's very very laggy (If I go to menu on startup before selecting game
> it's OK).

Laggy menus have indeed "sometimes" occurred for me, but I just ignored it. That isn't core gameplay, so it's not big deal (to me).

> I also have problems with mouse wheel and mid. button binging on
> my Intelli mouse explorer.

I don't often use the mouse, only keyboard. Also, not sure what "binging" means. Perhaps you mean binding?

RayeR(R)

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CZ,
27.01.2016, 03:28

@ Rugxulo
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

> -sndpci works on this PC, too (Intel HDA).

Yeah, new sound lib is the biggest innovation for DOS in past year for me :)

> fastest speed, perhaps it's best to stick to low res (320x200).

Sure, but you know how 320x200 looks at 21" - much worse than on old 14" CRT in ancient days. I used 1600x1200 native but neither switch to 800x600 or 640x480 made it smooth in such cases of visible taranl. objects. It must be some bug or heavy unoptimization in the engine...

> Laggy menus have indeed "sometimes" occurred for me, but I just ignored it.
> That isn't core gameplay, so it's not big deal (to me).

Yes, but anoying when you you want to tune something in menu or just load/save. Quake2 DOS doesn't have such problem.

> I don't often use the mouse, only keyboard. Also, not sure what "binging"
> means. Perhaps you mean binding?

Yes, I meant binding. I use mouse wheel for weapon prev/next change usually in other games.

This is just list of bugs that I observed, I don't want to blame anybody...

BTW Eric told me that you told that new RactOS significantly improved NTVDM to make DN3D playable :) Nice, I'll try (if it will boot on my real machine)...

---
DOS gives me freedom to unlimited HW access.

Rugxulo(R)

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Usono,
27.01.2016, 04:14

@ RayeR
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

> > -sndpci works on this PC, too (Intel HDA).
>
> Yeah, new sound lib is the biggest innovation for DOS in past year for me
> :)

Honestly, I'm surprised we even have a new release. Though Ozkan is an awesome developer, of course. But I heavily played the heck out of older 1.5.6, so it's pretty stable already.

> > fastest speed, perhaps it's best to stick to low res (320x200).
>
> Sure, but you know how 320x200 looks at 21" - much worse than on old 14"
> CRT in ancient days. I used 1600x1200 native but neither switch to 800x600
> or 640x480 made it smooth in such cases of visible taranl. objects. It must
> be some bug or heavy unoptimization in the engine...

I think native DOS using VESA is never going to match other solutions. Honestly, I think I got much higher framerates under DOSEMU than even Linux or Windows native!

But anyways, try something like "320x240" if you can. Maybe that's better than nothing?

> > Laggy menus have indeed "sometimes" occurred for me, but I just ignored
> it.
> > That isn't core gameplay, so it's not big deal (to me).
>
> Yes, but anoying when you you want to tune something in menu or just
> load/save. Quake2 DOS doesn't have such problem.

Just press F2 to save or F3 to load.

> > I don't often use the mouse, only keyboard. Also, not sure what
> "binging"
> > means. Perhaps you mean binding?
>
> Yes, I meant binding. I use mouse wheel for weapon prev/next change usually
> in other games.

I haven't tried, I prefer raw keyboard, personally.

> This is just list of bugs that I observed, I don't want to blame
> anybody...

No, of course not, but I'm not a developer for it, so what do I care? :-P ;-)

> BTW Eric told me that you told that new RactOS significantly improved NTVDM
> to make DN3D playable :) Nice, I'll try (if it will boot on my real
> machine)...

I haven't tried it, but they made a video a while back. 0.4.0rc2 has been uploaded, so the full release is probably soon-ish, if I had to blindly guess.

BTW, the biggest DN3D fan in the world is LGR, and he just uploaded a full review of the main game. Seriously, he's one of the best YouTubers, by far.

Laaca(R)

Homepage

Czech republic,
29.01.2016, 20:23

@ Rugxulo
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

> But anyways, try something like "320x240" if you can. Maybe that's better
> than nothing?
>

Nonsense.
Games like Hexen2 are designed for higer resolutions and in 300x200 or 320x240 look very ugly, much worse than f.e. Doom.

I played Hammer of Thyrion on my PII-300 machine in 640x480 which is perfect. In 800x600 is it still playable but slow, the feeling from the game is worse.

The "sand storm" effect in menu is annoying and certainly very badly optimized but fortunately it is only in menu.
Other slowdowns are caused in scenes with windows - break them to speed up the game and with water but it is stil acceptable.

But I am writting this post because I tried HoT 1.5.7 on my machine with Voodoo2 card. I have to repeat what I wrote about Quake2 on this card. It looks beautiful. There is no slowdown with windows glassesm water or in the menu.
The effect in menu does not more look like a sand storm - it is rather fog or smoke. Nothing special but at least it is not slow.

---
DOS-u-akbar!

Rugxulo(R)

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Usono,
30.01.2016, 02:05

@ Laaca
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

> > But anyways, try something like "320x240" if you can. Maybe that's
> > better than nothing?
>
> Nonsense.
> Games like Hexen2 are designed for higer resolutions and in 300x200 or
> 320x240 look very ugly, much worse than f.e. Doom.

Designed for higher VESA modes, yes, but VESA isn't always well optimized.

Anyways, I disagree about "very ugly", it looks fine to me, I'm not picky. But you could definitely say that about Doom or Quake, just in general, compared to modern titles.

> I played Hammer of Thyrion on my PII-300 machine in 640x480 which is
> perfect. In 800x600 is it still playable but slow, the feeling from the
> game is worse.

(quoting what I told Ozkan via email a few years ago)

Rugxulo -- Nov. 28, 2011 -- Lenovo Core i5 3.2 Ghz 6 GB RAM (Intel
Ironlake? VESA 3 gfx)

Hexen2 1.5.1 / DJGPP natively atop FreeDOS kernel 2040 w/ XMSv3 (XMGR)
+ CWSDPMI r7, "timedemo demo1"

320x200: 12.8 seconds, 194.8 FPS
320x240: 15.2 seconds, 164.0 FPS
360x400: 28.3 seconds, 88.3 FPS
640x480 : 118.2 seconds, 21.1 FPS
800x600: 180.7 seconds, 13.8 FPS
1024x768: 289.7 seconds 8.6 FPS

P.S. Before I forget, let me run at least one or two timedemos under
DOSEMU (1.4.0) for comparison. Let's try 640x480 and 1024x768 (Lucid
Puppy Linux 5.28 / kernel 2.6.33.2 / i686):

640x480: 7.7 seconds, 326.1 FPS
1024x768: 15.7 seconds, 159.5 FPS

Okay, lemme also try Linux native (1.5.1, 32-bit):

640x480: 12.2 seconds, 204.5 FPS
1024x768: 21.2 seconds, 117.8 FPS

(end quote)

See what I mean? DOSEMU wins! ;-) (BTW, originally I played exclusively under DOSEMU [because DOS, duh] due to sound support.)

> The "sand storm" effect in menu is annoying and certainly very badly
> optimized but fortunately it is only in menu.
> Other slowdowns are caused in scenes with windows - break them to speed up
> the game and with water but it is stil acceptable.

I never notice any slowdown, but I stick to low res. And I've comfortably played and beaten the game dozens of times. I also don't use any fancy monitors, so maybe I'm not seeing the detail you're seeing.

> But I am writting this post because I tried HoT 1.5.7 on my machine with
> Voodoo2 card. I have to repeat what I wrote about Quake2 on this card. It
> looks beautiful. There is no slowdown with windows glassesm water or in the
> menu.
> The effect in menu does not more look like a sand storm - it is rather fog
> or smoke. Nothing special but at least it is not slow.

I don't have any "fancy" video cards, just generic Intel integrated gfx. No slowdown, but like I said, higher resolution does make it worse, so caveat emptor.

RayeR(R)

Homepage

CZ,
30.01.2016, 02:20

@ Rugxulo
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

> Designed for higher VESA modes, yes, but VESA isn't always well optimized.

How do you mean optimized? VESA LFB modes are the same like VGA 320x200 (same MMIO, with Write Combining set I got about 2GB/s via PCIe so it really shouldn't be a bottleneck), just only more pixels so it should decrease FPS proportionally to more pixels. No special optimization/acceleration involved.

> Anyways, I disagree about "very ugly", it looks fine to me, I'm not picky.
> But you could definitely say that about Doom or Quake, just in general,
> compared to modern titles.

Yes it is ugly. When this games was released it was 14" analog CRT as standard. Now it's common 21-24" LCDs that mean pixel size increased a lot and it looks boxy like minecraft :P

> Hexen2 1.5.1 / DJGPP natively atop FreeDOS kernel 2040 w/ XMSv3 (XMGR)
> + CWSDPMI r7, "timedemo demo1"

Nice, I could mesure too. But does demo1 shows water or other trans. objects? Who cares if got 100 or 200 FPS when you come to water and it drops to 5FPS. Even on 2600k @4,5GHz powerfull machine. Ozkan knows about this issue.
Nice to see, as Laaca proved, that 3Dfx doesn't suffer this perf. impact.

---
DOS gives me freedom to unlimited HW access.

marcov(R)

30.01.2016, 20:24

@ Rugxulo
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

> > > But anyways, try something like "320x240" if you can. Maybe that's
> > > better than nothing?
> >
> > Nonsense.
> > Games like Hexen2 are designed for higer resolutions and in 300x200 or
> > 320x240 look very ugly, much worse than f.e. Doom.
>
> Designed for higher VESA modes, yes, but VESA isn't always well optimized.

From what I remember Voodoo (dos based video acceleration) and pure software emulation looks very different.

I only had voodoo1 though when I played these titles.

RayeR(R)

Homepage

CZ,
31.01.2016, 00:36

@ marcov
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

> From what I remember Voodoo (dos based video acceleration) and pure
> software emulation looks very different.

Yes, V1 allowed run this games at least 640x480/Hicolor with biliear filtering of textures so it looked very different.

---
DOS gives me freedom to unlimited HW access.

sezeroz(R)

13.02.2016, 12:17

@ Rugxulo
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

> On 25 Jan 2016, the developers of Hammer of Thyrion (HeXen II)
> released version 1.5.7.
>

Posted an updated glide3x.dxe, fixing 3Dfx OpenGL rendering
on Macronix (MX86251) variants of Voodoo Rush cards:
http://sf.net/projects/uhexen2/files/Hammer%20of%20Thyrion/1.5.7/DOS/
http://sf.net/project/downloading.php?group_id=124...filename=hexen2-1.5.7-dos-voodoorush-update.zip

Also updated the demo version package for dos to include the
updated driver:
http://sf.net/projects/uhexen2/files/Hexen2Demo-Aug.1997/

Rugxulo(R)

Homepage

Usono,
28.02.2016, 04:55

@ sezeroz
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

BTW, with the new version, I've successfully completed the game as Crusader and Paladin (320x240, DOSBox under Ubuntu 14.04.3 LTS jump drive), so at least it still works. :-P Just FYI.

sezeroz(R)

15.03.2016, 19:56

@ Rugxulo
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

I made some gl/glide driver updates to the opengl version and repackaged
the demo version dos:
http://sf.net/projects/uhexen2/files/Hexen2Demo-Aug.1997/

If there are 3dfx users out there, especially the ones with an SLI setup,
I would like to hear their feedback so that I know if anything is broken.

Laaca(R)

Homepage

Czech republic,
22.03.2016, 21:20

@ sezeroz
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

> If there are 3dfx users out there, especially the ones with an SLI setup,
> I would like to hear their feedback so that I know if anything is broken.

I don't have any SLI configuration but only good old Voodoo2 card and I am glad to say that everything works (just like before) and nothing is broken in this version.

The size reduction of 3DFX drivers is indeed very impressive.

---
DOS-u-akbar!

Rugxulo(R)

Homepage

Usono,
14.06.2016, 03:46

@ sezeroz
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

I debated whether to even mention this, but it's not provably worse, so I didn't email you privately.

I haven't played much on my Lenovo desktop lately (where -sndpci works), and on my Dell laptop I usually use other OSes (i.e. -sndpci won't work there).

But I did play the demo (Assassin) on my desktop recently, and it seemed strangely harder because the spiders were too fast and too aggressive, even at the very beginning of the game. Now, since I've beaten the game a billion times by now, always using hardest difficulty, that seemed odd.

In the end I tried playing on both laptop and desktop, but it may have ultimately just been my imagination. (BTW, I did notice the DOS demo claims to be 1.5.8 from May, which is not apparently released yet for the full version.)

You could probably ascribe it to the high difficulty or even the fact that the player has no armor and is incredibly weak (level one) at startup. Long story short: it's probably wise to skip trying to kill everything, just run away, until level up. That's a more sane strategy.

I doubt the spider A.I. (or internal timing) has changed much since 1.5.7, has it? So again, it's probably just my imagination.

sezeroz(R)

15.06.2016, 17:12

@ Rugxulo
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

> But I did play the demo (Assassin) on my desktop recently, and it seemed
> strangely harder because the spiders were too fast and too aggressive, even
> at the very beginning of the game. Now, since I've beaten the game a
> billion times by now, always using hardest difficulty, that seemed odd.

This is the august-1997 version of the demo, yes? It really _is_ harder.
And no, I never touch the game logic (progs.dat) in that version of the
demo at all.

Rugxulo(R)

Homepage

Usono,
16.06.2016, 18:57

@ sezeroz
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

> This is the august-1997 version of the demo, yes?

13741595 2016-05-20 17:32 hexen2demo_aug1997-dos.zip

> It really _is_ harder.

I mean, in the demo, two or three spiders can kill you, from full health to zero, in less than five seconds. (The other character, I forget which [Crusader?], in the two-char demo, is apparently a bit stronger than Assassin.) Of course, maybe using hardest difficulty is asking for it, but the full game doesn't seem so aggressive. I suspect the enemies are just too powerful here.

> And no, I never touch the game logic (progs.dat) in that version of the
> demo at all.

There may be a few bugs. Video mode didn't change (actually, restore) properly, e.g. trying 320x240, unlike full game. Also, at one rare point it seemed to endlessly loop changing weapon. At another point it explicitly crashed (well, to game console), running into Skull Wizard, but I couldn't reproduce it (tried -devlog, never reappeared).

I did indeed just now beat the demo on hardest difficulty with Assassin, but it wasn't easy. I had long ago run out of mana and had no health potions, so I basically had to run past a lot of stuff. I know I had previously beaten the demo a billion times, but perhaps I didn't use hardest difficulty.

Or maybe it's something dumb like some TSRs or whatever in the background, screwing with the timer. But I tried a more "raw" setup the other day and didn't notice much difference.

I'll try some more later.

sezeroz(R)

16.06.2016, 22:16

@ Rugxulo
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

> > This is the august-1997 version of the demo, yes?
>
> 13741595 2016-05-20 17:32 hexen2demo_aug1997-dos.zip
>

OK,

> > It really _is_ harder.
>
> I mean, in the demo, two or three spiders can kill you,

It is by design. Try the retail game on the same setup
with the same player class and difficulty and you will see
the difference.

> There may be a few bugs. Video mode didn't change (actually, restore)
> properly, e.g. trying 320x240, unlike full game.

This I am interested in: What did you intend to do? What
did happen and what did not happen? It would be better to
send the details to my email, as I may miss reading here.

> Also, at one rare point it
> seemed to endlessly loop changing weapon. At another point it explicitly
> crashed (well, to game console), running into Skull Wizard, but I couldn't
> reproduce it (tried -devlog, never reappeared).
>

Bugs in hexenc game code (progs.dat), and I don't edit the
demo version's hexenc code.

Rugxulo(R)

Homepage

Usono,
16.06.2016, 22:53

@ sezeroz
 

Hammer of Thyrion 1.5.7

> > I mean, in the demo, two or three spiders can kill you,
>
> It is by design. Try the retail game on the same setup
> with the same player class and difficulty and you will see
> the difference.

Of course I did that, I prefer the full game. But it's the kind of difference that one thinks one's just imagining.

But my opinion now is that the demo is "mostly" fine, just a bit tricky to complete. Of course you don't want it too easy. I just think the spiders are a bit too fast and unfairly aggressive, but you can run away and not kill everything too (duh).

> > There may be a few bugs. Video mode didn't change (actually, restore)
> > properly, e.g. trying 320x240, unlike full game.
>
> This I am interested in: What did you intend to do? What
> did happen and what did not happen? It would be better to
> send the details to my email, as I may miss reading here.

I tried again ("raw") and couldn't reproduce this. It could've been some rare TSR issue, who knows. (Normally I prefer 320x240 these days, which is hardly obscure.)

Okay, so I've now beaten the demo with Paladin, twice, on hardest difficulty (Lord). Even though it's fairly obvious (esp. to you), let me explain:

The very first room once you start the game has a torch and spiders. You push a wall switch and jump down the hatch to a room. My point is that, while jumping, trying to get down, the spiders can eat up like 20 points of your health! So in a very miniscule amount of time, you can easily get whittled down to nothing.

Even once you get to the room with the sliding coffin, there are two barrels. One of them has a quartz flask (health potion). Normally I kill and collect literally everything, but here I'm forced to skip a lot of enemies (and even that flask) just because I'll literally get killed very quickly! So I have to either come back or ignore some enemies (and items) entirely. That's not how I normally play the full game. Of course, I must admit that Paladin is stronger (and sword has longer reach) than Assassin. Maybe the arrows are supposed to help keep spiders away, long range, but it's so easy to run out of mana, plus the spiders are numerous and very fast.

Funny story: at one point I was at the Mill, trying to crush the bones. I got attacked down to literally 1 HP. I ran up the slope to get the Mystic Urn, but I see a horseman. I had to (very quickly) use a Disc of Repulsion to throw him off, then I got my health up to 100+ HP, which is quite good! Nice save, I thought, but when I went to get the bone dust, the windmill accidentally crushed/killed me! C'e la vie. :-P

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