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Ninho(R)

E-mail

29.04.2009, 13:28
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ? (Users)

Guys ! Since I was able to add nice looking wide screen text modes (132,148,160 columns) on my poor SiS based board, I'm now looking for a good text editor (Buerg's "list" is OK but for viewing only; Microsoft's "edit" adapts to non standrad number of lines but crashes miserably on anything other than 40/80 chars wide !)

Requirement : editor must adapt itself to any screen size it finds on entry (as described in the BIOS data area). Additional niceties : should be able to show 2 files side by side, allowing one or the other to be scrolled independently (a la Buerg's).

Is there such a beast available (free being a very nice plus) - or would we (I) have to write one ?

---
Ninho

rr(R)

Homepage E-mail

Berlin, Germany,
29.04.2009, 21:27

@ Ninho
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> Is there such a beast available (free being a very nice plus) - or would
> we (I) have to write one ?

Try JED, FED, Aurora, TDE, FTE, VDE, Vim, ...

Ninho(R)

E-mail

30.04.2009, 17:13

@ rr
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

>> Is there such a beast available (free being a very nice plus)

> Try JED, FED, Aurora, TDE, FTE, VDE, Vim, ...

Ah, Aurora looks nice. It is abandonware & OK to use it without payment, right ?
Personal use is what I mean.


Thx

--
Ninho

---
Ninho

rr(R)

Homepage E-mail

Berlin, Germany,
30.04.2009, 17:34

@ Ninho
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> > Try JED, FED, Aurora, TDE, FTE, VDE, Vim, ...
>
> Ah, Aurora looks nice. It is abandonware & OK to use it without payment,
> right ?

Exactly.

marcov(R)

05.05.2009, 09:00

@ Ninho
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> Guys ! Since I was able to add nice looking wide screen text modes
> (132,148,160 columns) on my poor SiS based board, I'm now looking for a
> good text editor (Buerg's "list" is OK but for viewing only; Microsoft's
> "edit" adapts to non standrad number of lines but crashes miserably on
> anything other than 40/80 chars wide !)

> Is there such a beast available (free being a very nice plus) - or would
> we (I) have to write one ?

Not a real contender maybe (though it fits the requirements), but if you are interested in this kind of stuff, could you test if the FPC textmode IDE scales properly?

Ninho(R)

E-mail

05.05.2009, 11:03

@ marcov
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> Not a real contender maybe (though it fits the requirements), but if you
> are interested in this kind of stuff, could you test if the FPC textmode
> IDE scales properly?

That would be the "free Pascal", right ? Well I don't have or need the suite, never liked Pascal (being an old fan of Dijkstra's Algol, and later of the remarkable Simula 67)... But for your sake I can quick test the IDE for compatibility in exotic test modes - I'd rather take a minimum download if possible, just the IDE and no invasive installation; awaiting your suggestions.

---
Ninho

DOS386(R)

05.05.2009, 14:07

@ Ninho
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> rather take a minimum download if possible, just the IDE and no invasive
> installation; awaiting your suggestions

Download the full package (50 MiB) or minimal package (18 MiB, no docs !?!?), there is no bloat, they use UPX :clap:

> Requirement : editor must adapt itself to any screen size it finds on entry (as
> described in the BIOS data area).

FASM IDE

> Additional niceties : should be able to show 2 files side by side, allowing one or
> the other to be scrolled independently (a la Buerg's)

Keep dreaming :-|

---
This is a LOGITECH mouse driver, but some software expect here
the following string:*** This is Copyright 1983 Microsoft ***

Laaca(R)

Homepage

Czech republic,
05.05.2009, 16:39

@ marcov
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

Nor Freepascal IDE nor Turbo pascal IDE can keep non standard text mode which they can't self set. Generaly - all text editrs which enable to change the video modes can't do that because it hasn't any logic to support a mode which you can leave but which you can't return to.

The only exception I know is Setedit which can let the videomode managment to user external utility.

---
DOS-u-akbar!

Ninho(R)

E-mail

05.05.2009, 17:14

@ Laaca
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> Nor Freepascal IDE nor Turbo pascal IDE can keep non standard text mode
> which they can't self set. Generaly - all text editrs which enable to
> change the video modes can't do that because it hasn't any logic to
> support a mode which you can leave but which you can't return to.

Well, there is a well defined interface available to task switchers, or any program indeed, allowing them to save/restore video modes, at least for a subset of modes (does not work for modes using non standard 'super-'VGA features). The interface I'm having in mind is, of course, that of DOS's EGA.SYS (also implemented by the mouse driver if EGA.SYS is not loaded, and by Windows, of course. BTW, one reason I can't recommend CTMOUSE for serious DOS users is that it doesn't implement said interface.)

> The only exception I know is Setedit which can let the videomode managment
> to user external utility.

This settles the question, I shall pass the opportunity of downloading the Freepascal IDE. Time is sparse!

T.Y.

---
Ninho

Ninho(R)

E-mail

26.05.2009, 16:38
(edited by Ninho, 26.05.2009, 20:42)

@ Ninho
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

Sometimes ago I wrote :

> that of DOS's EGA.SYS (also implemented by the mouse driver if EGA.SYS is
> not loaded, and by Windows, of course. BTW, one reason I can't recommend
> CTMOUSE for serious DOS users is that it doesn't implement said
> interface.)

I was running a not so fresh CTMouse version 1.8.
It sometimes pays to try new releases : turns out CTMouse
2.1 beta 4 now deals correctly with changed video modes,
and in addition the roulette (scrolling wheel) is also
working fine for me :=) Tested just fine° in Arachne/DOS !

[Edit]° Oooops! The CTMouse hangs up after an variable time lapse,
after which I have to exit Arachne using the keyboard, unload/reload
the mouse driver. They don't call it 'beta' in vain :-(
Is it only me, or did you experience similar problems with CTMouse ?

Any advice for a solid DOS mouse driver that handles the wheel ?[/Edit]

So long....

---
Ninho

rr(R)

Homepage E-mail

Berlin, Germany,
26.05.2009, 21:00

@ Ninho
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> Any advice for a solid DOS mouse driver that handles the wheel ?

No, AFAIK. Because CuteMouse is the only mouse driver for DOS which provides an extendend API for applications to support the mouse wheel.

Rugxulo(R)

Homepage

Usono,
26.05.2009, 21:34

@ rr
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> > Any advice for a solid DOS mouse driver that handles the wheel ?
>
> No, AFAIK. Because CuteMouse is the only mouse driver for DOS which
> provides an extendend API for applications to support the mouse wheel.

What was the first CuteMouse to support the wheel anyways? I suggest to report such a bug to Eric Auer (current maintainer), but specifically test older 1.9.1 and 2.0a4 first to see if there is a regression or if it never worked (so he knows what he's dealing with).

P.S. CWS's ED 1.6 is in WIP stage and getting close to a release.

rr(R)

Homepage E-mail

Berlin, Germany,
26.05.2009, 21:46

@ Rugxulo
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> > > Any advice for a solid DOS mouse driver that handles the wheel ?
> >
> > No, AFAIK. Because CuteMouse is the only mouse driver for DOS which
> > provides an extendend API for applications to support the mouse wheel.
>
> What was the first CuteMouse to support the wheel anyways?

The wheel API is only present in 2.x versions. So it all started in version 2.0.

> I suggest to
> report such a bug to Eric Auer (current maintainer),

ACK

Rugxulo(R)

Homepage

Usono,
27.05.2009, 00:53

@ rr
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> > > > Any advice for a solid DOS mouse driver that handles the wheel ?
> > >
> > > No, AFAIK. Because CuteMouse is the only mouse driver for DOS which
> > > provides an extendend API for applications to support the mouse
> wheel.
> >
> > What was the first CuteMouse to support the wheel anyways?
>
> The wheel API is only present in 2.x versions. So it all started in
> version 2.0.

That's what I thought, just couldn't remember for sure. 2.0 doesn't use the BIOS but 2.1b4 does, so maybe it's a BIOS bug for Ninho. :-|

> > I suggest to
> > report such a bug to Eric Auer (current maintainer),
>
> ACK

Hmmmm? :-)

Ninho(R)

E-mail

27.05.2009, 22:30

@ Rugxulo
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> > > What was the first CuteMouse to support the wheel anyways?
> >
> > The wheel API is only present in 2.x versions. So it all started in
> > version 2.0.
>
> That's what I thought, just couldn't remember for sure. 2.0 doesn't use
> the BIOS but 2.1b4 does, so maybe it's a BIOS bug for Ninho. :-|

Problem has been seen *only* in Arachne, and *only* when CTmouse is supposed to process the roulette. Maybe mouse interrupts/packets get lost while Arachne is doing some strange stuff under the hood (when spawning external DOS programs ? clearing the interrupt flag for 'a little' too long perhaps?). I suspect an Arachne bug before a problem of CTMouse. BICBW.

I'll try the 2.0 branch of CTMouse for comparison.

> > > I suggest to
> > > report such a bug to Eric Auer (current maintainer),

Provided it's his bug...

> Hmmmm? :-)

;-)

---
Ninho

DOS386(R)

01.06.2009, 15:33

@ Ninho
 

CTRat

> > I can't recommend CTMOUSE
> > for serious DOS users is that it doesn't implement
> I was running a not so fresh CTMouse version 1.8.

8 years old :clap:

> and in addition the roulette (scrolling wheel) is also working

Russian roulette ...

> [Edit]° Oooops! The CTMouse hangs up after an variable time lapse,

What do you mean ??? Arrow doesn't react to mouse movements anymore,
but Arachne still reacts to keypresses ???

> Is it only me, or did you experience similar problems with CTMouse ?

I never got this problem ...

> Any advice for a solid DOS mouse driver that handles the wheel ?[/Edit]

CTMouse ;-)

BTW, for a really solid quality one probably would have to redesign the thing a bit ;-)

---
This is a LOGITECH mouse driver, but some software expect here
the following string:*** This is Copyright 1983 Microsoft ***

Ninho(R)

E-mail

04.06.2009, 20:09

@ DOS386
 

CTRat

>> I was running a not so fresh CTMouse version 1.8.

> 8 years old :clap:

I use much much older software regularly. Software doesn't age or wear ;=)

>> and in addition the roulette (scrolling wheel) is also working

> Russian roulette ...

- indeed ! -

>> [Edit]° Oooops! The CTMouse hangs up after an variable time lapse,

> What do you mean ??? Arrow doesn't react to mouse movements anymore,
> but Arachne still reacts to keypresses ???

Exact. When it happens I can for instance shell out of Arachne, reset the mouse driver (by calling it again, ctmouse -O ), return to Arachne and all is right, until it eventually locks up again.

> I never got this problem ...

CTMouse + Arachne ?

---
Ninho

DOS386(R)

05.06.2009, 07:14

@ Ninho
 

CTRat

> > I never got this problem ...
> CTMouse + Arachne ?

Actually, I had crashes in the past and now am no longer sure whether the PC was fully frozen or only the mouse arrow ... not sure whether I tried the keyboard at all :crying: However recently the problem seems to have gone :-|

---
This is a LOGITECH mouse driver, but some software expect here
the following string:*** This is Copyright 1983 Microsoft ***

Ninho(R)

E-mail

06.06.2009, 17:52

@ DOS386
 

CTRat

> > > I never got this problem ...
> > CTMouse + Arachne ?

> Actually, I had crashes in the past and now am no longer sure whether the
> PC was fully frozen or only the mouse arrow ... not sure whether I tried
> the keyboard at all :crying: However recently the problem seems to have
> gone :-|

The kind of fix I like :=)

Actually, I've experienced the problems autofix, too; that is, no more
freezing. Not investigated much for lack of time - but an hypothesis I
can hasard at least : the prior freeze may have been due to interference
with the okd faithful DOS keyboard driver (swapped for a different one) and/or TSR load order (esp. between
mouse/kb/network card). I couldn't in all honesty claim that CTMouse 2.1 was the
bugger. Come to think of it, the "STACKS=0,0" settings could be a problem (but probably not
here, since I didn't change it)


Cheers...

---
Ninho

Rugxulo(R)

Homepage

Usono,
05.05.2009, 19:35

@ marcov
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> Not a real contender maybe (though it fits the requirements), but if you
> are interested in this kind of stuff, could you test if the FPC textmode
> IDE scales properly?

BTW, this isn't directly related, but maybe you're interested in knowing what the currently prepared / selected CON codepage is in DOS (see here).

ho1459(R)

Homepage E-mail

Germany,
08.05.2009, 12:36

@ Ninho
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> Guys ! Since I was able to add nice looking wide screen text modes
> (132,148,160 columns) on my poor SiS based board, I'm now looking for a
> good text editor (Buerg's "list" is OK but for viewing only; Microsoft's
> "edit" adapts to non standrad number of lines but crashes miserably on
> anything other than 40/80 chars wide !)
>
> Requirement : editor must adapt itself to any screen size it finds on
> entry (as described in the BIOS data area). Additional niceties : should
> be able to show 2 files side by side, allowing one or the other to be
> scrolled independently (a la Buerg's).
>
> Is there such a beast available (free being a very nice plus) - or would
> we (I) have to write one ?

NDN should adapt to any given window size.
It can also set a variety of custom video modes.
Of course it's more than just an editor.
Give it a try: http://ndn.muxe.com.

Left/Right file display is also possible.

Stefan / AH

Ninho(R)

E-mail

08.05.2009, 20:30

@ ho1459
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> NDN should adapt to any given window size.
> It can also set a variety of custom video modes.
> Of course it's more than just an editor.
> Give it a try: http://ndn.muxe.com.

Indeed, nice pick ! Not sure I'll end up using it really : I'm used to "my" command line so much ;=) Though I was once a user of 1DIRPLUS a kind of 'DOS commander' , in prehistoric times (well, in the 80's...)

Thanks for the heads up

---
Ninho

RayeR(R)

Homepage

CZ,
09.05.2009, 21:28

@ Ninho
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> Indeed, nice pick ! Not sure I'll end up using it really : I'm used to
> "my" command line so much ;=) Though I was once a user of 1DIRPLUS a kind
> of 'DOS commander' , in prehistoric times (well, in the 80's...)

I rather use latest DN-OSP. One binary run well both in DOS/WIN9X/NT-XP (NDN DOS binary have some problems under NT-XP). I use NDN under linux but still some controls work wrong so I cannot live without MC.

---
DOS gives me freedom to unlimited HW access.

ho1459(R)

Homepage E-mail

Germany,
15.05.2009, 13:42

@ RayeR
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> > Indeed, nice pick ! Not sure I'll end up using it really : I'm used to
> > "my" command line so much ;=) Though I was once a user of 1DIRPLUS a
> kind
> > of 'DOS commander' , in prehistoric times (well, in the 80's...)
>
> I rather use latest DN-OSP. One binary run well both in DOS/WIN9X/NT-XP
> (NDN DOS binary have some problems under NT-XP). I use NDN under linux but
> still some controls work wrong so I cannot live without MC.

Are there any solvable NDN-D32 problems left in NT+?

Note that real mode programs work better in NT+ than DPMI programs.

The W9x clipboard f.ex. is not supported in NT+.

DPMI/NTVDM programs in NT+ always take too much system power so these have
to be run in the lowest possible base priority class.

Stefan / AH

RayeR(R)

Homepage

CZ,
16.05.2009, 04:15

@ ho1459
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> Are there any solvable NDN-D32 problems left in NT+?
> Note that real mode programs work better in NT+ than DPMI programs.

E.g. there's problem with running cmd/command.com. I have set various programs to be run for specified extension (dn.ext) and this doesn't work in NDN for DOS under WinXP. Also this NDN takes about 15s to start it seems it has something to do with detecting drives.
DN OSP for DOS run fine under win9x/nt/xp.

I reported it ~year ago but nobody have time to solve it.

---
DOS gives me freedom to unlimited HW access.

ho1459(R)

Homepage E-mail

Germany,
16.05.2009, 14:55

@ RayeR
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> > Are there any solvable NDN-D32 problems left in NT+?
> > Note that real mode programs work better in NT+ than DPMI programs.
>
> E.g. there's problem with running cmd/command.com. I have set various
> programs to be run for specified extension (dn.ext) and this doesn't work
> in NDN for DOS under WinXP. Also this NDN takes about 15s to start it
> seems it has something to do with detecting drives.
> DN OSP for DOS run fine under win9x/nt/xp.
>
> I reported it ~year ago but nobody have time to solve it.

That rings a bell.
True, I still don't know when I will take a look at the remaining
XP/D32 problems.

Thanks for reminding me,
Stefan / AH

flox(R)

Homepage

12.05.2009, 08:58

@ ho1459
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> NDN should adapt to any given window size.
> It can also set a variety of custom video modes.
> Of course it's more than just an editor.
> Give it a try: http://ndn.muxe.com.

I use NDN as main editor as well although it hasn't the features of other editors because with the additional file manager it is very practical in a single-task environment (and not only there).

flox

ho1459(R)

Homepage E-mail

Germany,
15.05.2009, 13:43

@ flox
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> > NDN should adapt to any given window size.
> > It can also set a variety of custom video modes.
> > Of course it's more than just an editor.
> > Give it a try: http://ndn.muxe.com.
>
> I use NDN as main editor as well although it hasn't the features of other
> editors because with the additional file manager it is very practical in a
> single-task environment (and not only there).

I always like to hear ideas for new features, esp. for the editor...

Stefan / AH

Rugxulo(R)

Homepage

Usono,
14.05.2009, 01:53

@ Ninho
 

Any DOS text editor for nonstandard screen widths ?

> Guys ! Since I was able to add nice looking wide screen text modes
> (132,148,160 columns) on my poor SiS based board, I'm now looking for a
> good text editor (Buerg's "list" is OK but for viewing only; Microsoft's
> "edit" adapts to non standrad number of lines but crashes miserably on
> anything other than 40/80 chars wide !)
>
> Requirement : editor must adapt itself to any screen size it finds on
> entry (as described in the BIOS data area). Additional niceties : should
> be able to show 2 files side by side, allowing one or the other to be
> scrolled independently (a la Buerg's).
>
> Is there such a beast available (free being a very nice plus) - or would
> we (I) have to write one ?

Since CWS (cwsdpmi _AT_ earthlink _DOT_ net) is updating his "ED" ports for DOS (and XP, etc.) soon, and I was e-mailing him about something else anyways, I decided to ask him about it:

>> (CWS): it supports any text resolution currently in use, and can set
>> the mode automatically for 50x80, 43x80 and 132x50 if your video bios
>> supports the non-vesa mode my video card did in 1991 ...

And yes, it supports multiple files on the screen, including a dired-ish file manager among other goodies. It's basically a clone of EDT. The old standard DOS binary (DJGPPv1 w/ custom GO32 from 1994) is here:

http://clio.rice.edu/EDstuff/
http://clio.rice.edu/EDstuff/EDDOS157.exe (.LZH sfx)
http://clio.rice.edu/EDstuff/ED-157.zip (C srcs)

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